shannonl5
3 years ago5,000+ Views

... "I'll know it when I see it?"

The Marvel community is doing a great job discussing issues of representation and diversity, so it seems like a good time to open up the discussion. What is positive diversity? Is there a perfect way to depict a character from a specific group? How should we respond when it's done poorly? What if, as in the case of the Red Wolf comic, there's both progressive representation and regressive business practices?
I'm really grateful to all of the support I've gotten for my card about female representation in the media. I'm extremely grateful to @WayneWinquist @VinMcCarthy @MattK95 @buddyesd @JPBenedetto @RobertMarsh and @baileykayleen for all of their thoughtful comments. I'm glad you're all here making the community a safe place to share ideas!
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@YoSoySoysauce that makes a lot of sense. Yeah, you're right. The comics had a lot of progressive characterizations that never made it to film. Mystique for example is canonically bisexual in the comics, but she's not in the films. The Falcon had a lot of great story arcs in the comics but so far he's had a very small role in the films. Yeah, I'm hoping that the policies will change, but it does seem like the people at the top have zero interest in actually pursuing the kind of diversity you and @buddyesd are talking about. They'll put one or two token characters in, but they won't put them in the spotlight, won't give them their own stories or development. They get treated more like props than characters. That's not positive representation. That's barely even trying
it seems they do have to start making new characters that we can connect/relate to. everyone's argument for not having an lgbt or poc super hero movie is that they weren't like that in the movies. something else that might have to be taken into consideration is that even if a character is written as something other than white and straight they might not be written that way in the movie. (if they even get one at all.) I think there was an email leaked from some marvel people saying that there will never be a non-white non-heterosexual spidey.
@buddyesd oh my goodness I would LOVE to read that story. I think you make a lot of sense. A while back I remember @Goyo commented that he wished they would make more new characters, instead of remaking old ones as characters of a different race or gender. And I do think that with The Hulk, people do have some attachment to the old version, which means that there's all this extra pressure on the new character. The same is true of the Miles Morales spider man. But you're right. What matters is the universal story being told. Someone overcoming adversity, despite people not believing in them, or someone who believes in justice but has their beliefs challenged, at their core those stories can be told by anyone. Just throwing in a character of color or a woman and calling it a day isn't enough. They have to have depth. The have to be challenged and have arcs that are just as interesting as the other characters
@buddyesd oooh I definitely see what you mean. It shouldn't just be for show, it should be because the people working on the project actually care. Doing it to be controversial feels like they're just exploiting the really important conversations about diversity and representation that people are having. They're not actually trying to change anything and it does a disservice to all of the people who deserve more representation!
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@shannonl5 exactly :) for me the thing about Johnny storm is that sue storm was still white. why only change one? for that matter why Johnny and not Reed? I mean he's supposed to be the genius. I saw an attempt at changing something for the sake of saying they did something. I still haven't seen it yet so I can't speak to the acting but I mean it should be at least meaningful. I'm tired of controversial, I'm ready for meaningful.
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